Poll: Have you heard about the Slow Translation Manifesto? Аўтар тэмы: ProZ.com Staff
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This forum topic is for the discussion of the poll question "Have you heard about the Slow Translation Manifesto?".
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I didn’t know what it was and I had to google it, but ITI placed a name on what I have been doing for ages. My approach to translation has always been that of a “handicraft” rather than “machine made” or in the words of the Manifesto “prioritising artistry over automation”…
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Hadn't - now have
| | | | Astrid Elke Witte 
Германія
Local time: 06:17
Член (ад 2002)
нямецкая → англійская
+ ...
| The issue here is earning a living from translation | Aug 12 |
Wherever you are located, you probably know how much you need to earn per hour.
Now, imagine an agency makes you sign that you will do "slow translation", the following situation then arises:
The agency pays you the same hourly rate as usual, which is, however, in danger of decreasing (in terms of price per word for modern texts that are of ever-increasing complexity)
You have to put EVEN MORE effort into researching the topic and polishing the translation than yo... See more Wherever you are located, you probably know how much you need to earn per hour.
Now, imagine an agency makes you sign that you will do "slow translation", the following situation then arises:
The agency pays you the same hourly rate as usual, which is, however, in danger of decreasing (in terms of price per word for modern texts that are of ever-increasing complexity)
You have to put EVEN MORE effort into researching the topic and polishing the translation than you were already doing for the measly price
You are then left with earning EVEN LESS PER HOUR than before - and maybe you can then not pay your bills any more.
The ITI's intention is excellent. I fear, however, that it will not receive any financial backing from outsourcers. ▲ Collapse
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Mario Chávez
ЗША
Local time: 00:17
Член (ад Jun 2024)
англійская → іспанская
+ ...
| I've read it, don't agree with the gist of it | Aug 12 |
ITI's Slow Translation Manifesto is modeled after other slow movements, like slow tourism and slow food. Here's why I don't like the way it's formulated:
1) While I agree on how companies are overrelying on technologies of every kind to bring more content into more languages, the Manifesto keeps quiet on a key problem: the artificial need for speed or time-to-market;
2) Describing translators as “people who care about words and meaning” reveals a monumental failure:... See more ITI's Slow Translation Manifesto is modeled after other slow movements, like slow tourism and slow food. Here's why I don't like the way it's formulated:
1) While I agree on how companies are overrelying on technologies of every kind to bring more content into more languages, the Manifesto keeps quiet on a key problem: the artificial need for speed or time-to-market;
2) Describing translators as “people who care about words and meaning” reveals a monumental failure: translators don't translate words but texts (poorly named “content” these days);
3) Nowhere in the Manifesto is there mention of the importance of good writing, as if translators by definition wrote well-constructed texts.
I've been running my own slow translation policy for more than a decade so far, based simply on keeping accepted rush jobs to a minimum and taking the proper time to do research. However, the Manifesto scores a win when making reference to research.
Sadly, manifestoes like this are an attempt to keep peace with postmodernists (“linguistic diversity” and “cross-cultural competence,” whatever those two things mean) in detriment for projecting a clear, concise and effective discourse about translation proper. ▲ Collapse
| | | | Daryo
Вялікабрытанія
Local time: 05:17
сербская → англійская
+ ...
This Slow Translation Manifesto mostly sounds to me as the stating of what should be the blindingly obvious. To anyone, except to those who imagine that Taylorism could be applied to the translation process ...
The element that might not be missing, but is not emphasized enough is that a translation starts with understanding the source text - which no machine so far is capable of, a fact that no decibels of hype can hide.
Although I do have a strong objection to... See more This Slow Translation Manifesto mostly sounds to me as the stating of what should be the blindingly obvious. To anyone, except to those who imagine that Taylorism could be applied to the translation process ...
The element that might not be missing, but is not emphasized enough is that a translation starts with understanding the source text - which no machine so far is capable of, a fact that no decibels of hype can hide.
Although I do have a strong objection to the world "slow". It might give the wrong impression of someone slacking on the job.
First alternative I could think of would be "thorough", a much better word for describing a translation process leading to a good translation.
As for "earning a living from translation" there is no contradiction with a "thorough approach". The first translations I made for direct clients (no computers, no internet then, a telex was "high-tech") took me whatever time was necessary to (1) understand the text and (2) find the best translation. Which resulted in later no one questioning my rates when they approached me by recommandation. ▲ Collapse
| | | | | Now I know it first time. | Aug 13 |
Thanks to this forum, now I know about this. But I don't see it benifits translators, professionally. Because as Agencies/Clients are not willing to pay enough or not focus on translation's outcome just budget. So, it's not possible to provide good creative work with shrinking market and expanding MT enviorment.
After all, we all need money to pay bills. So, unless the whole scene is going to change especially for the rate purpsoe. I don't see any good it can do.
| | | | Justin Peterson
Іспанія
Local time: 06:17
Член (ад 2007)
іспанская → англійская
| Yes, and I've also heard of the Luddites | Aug 13 |
Translators bewailing the advance of MT is like typewriter manufacturers whining about the advent of the computer
There's no stopping it, you have to learn how to exploit AI and MT tools to translate more words/hour with higher quality
Scoffing at these tools is foolhardy. Embrace them, and use them to your advantage.
Of course you have to understand the original, of course there are some things MT can't do, of course there is still a role for human beings ... See more Translators bewailing the advance of MT is like typewriter manufacturers whining about the advent of the computer
There's no stopping it, you have to learn how to exploit AI and MT tools to translate more words/hour with higher quality
Scoffing at these tools is foolhardy. Embrace them, and use them to your advantage.
Of course you have to understand the original, of course there are some things MT can't do, of course there is still a role for human beings in translation, of course there are some texts with which it is useless ... but, generally speaking, MT is a revolutionary change that is here to stay, and is only going to get better and better, and we are sticking our heads in the sand if we pooh-pooh it. ▲ Collapse
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Mario Chávez
ЗША
Local time: 00:17
Член (ад Jun 2024)
англійская → іспанская
+ ...
Finally a colleague who knows what a telex machine was! 
Daryo wrote:
As for "earning a living from translation" there is no contradiction with a "thorough approach". The first translations I made for direct clients (no computers, no internet then, a telex was "high-tech") took me whatever time was necessary to (1) understand the text and (2) find the best translation. Which resulted in later no one questioning my rates when they approached me by recommandation.
| | | | Mario Chávez
ЗША
Local time: 00:17
Член (ад Jun 2024)
англійская → іспанская
+ ...
From other translators in the past I have heard a different word, craftmanship, instead of artistry. At least ITI didn't use the buzzwords du jour: innovation and creativity. 
Maria Teresa Borges de Almeida wrote:
I didn’t know what it was and I had to google it, but ITI placed a name on what I have been doing for ages. My approach to translation has always been that of a “handicraft” rather than “machine made” or in the words of the Manifesto “prioritising artistry over automation”…
| | | | Mario Chávez
ЗША
Local time: 00:17
Член (ад Jun 2024)
англійская → іспанская
+ ...
| Rather be foolhardy then :) | Aug 13 |
I was once called a luddite in a separate forum here on Proz for something I said about Trados, I think.
The typewriter vs. computer analogy doesn't fly, however. Apples and oranges. Both technologies involved a mechanical device for input and delivered output via paper or a screen (which some of us are still printing to paper). By contrast, MT, NMT, ChatGPT and its ilk and any other digital appliance are nonphysica... See more I was once called a luddite in a separate forum here on Proz for something I said about Trados, I think.
The typewriter vs. computer analogy doesn't fly, however. Apples and oranges. Both technologies involved a mechanical device for input and delivered output via paper or a screen (which some of us are still printing to paper). By contrast, MT, NMT, ChatGPT and its ilk and any other digital appliance are nonphysical tools that resort to simulacra (“intelligent,” “thinking,” “analytical,” etc.) to mimic human mental faculties. These are simply digital assistive technologies.
A lot of generative AI is hype, we know that. I think we are all well-informed professionals who find pros and cons in every technology we come across. Not because we are technologists by definition (or Luddites) but because we are innately curious and seek for ways to improve the mechanical means of delivering a translation. We're still using our brains and hands.
As for me, I don't embrace anything, unless it's a loved one or a dear friend. Tools are just tools, mere extensions of our biological faculties.
Justin Peterson wrote:
Translators bewailing the advance of MT is like typewriter manufacturers whining about the advent of the computer
There's no stopping it, you have to learn how to exploit AI and MT tools to translate more words/hour with higher quality
Scoffing at these tools is foolhardy. Embrace them, and use them to your advantage.
Of course you have to understand the original, of course there are some things MT can't do, of course there is still a role for human beings in translation, of course there are some texts with which it is useless ... but, generally speaking, MT is a revolutionary change that is here to stay, and is only going to get better and better, and we are sticking our heads in the sand if we pooh-pooh it.
▲ Collapse
| | | | Kay Denney
Францыя
Local time: 06:17
французская → англійская
Maria Teresa Borges de Almeida wrote:
I didn’t know what it was and I had to google it, but ITI placed a name on what I have been doing for ages. My approach to translation has always been that of a “handicraft” rather than “machine made” or in the words of the Manifesto “prioritising artistry over automation”…
Yes. A while back everyone was saying "out of quick, cheap and good, you can only pick two" and I always shot back that it's not quite that simple in that the quick and good combo is not possible. To produce a good translation, you need time. End of.
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